It's pretty sparse but you can't argue with much if any of it.
http://jephjacques.tumblr.com/post/596723785/so-you-want-to-start-a-webcomic
;)
Nothing really new there but it was nice to see someone put some hard figures about when you should consider merchandising. Considering he's one of the kings of webcomic merchandise, I take what he says quite seriously.
Very good advice on all counts. I... don't really have much to add - he got it all.
$15 is way too much for a domain.
http://www.namecheap.com (http://www.namecheap.com) can get you one for under $9 with their monthly coupon code.
I can't believe he waits until step 5 to get to the "draw your comic" part. It seems silly to me to go to the trouble of purchasing a domain name and building a website only to discover that you dislike your idea or you don't want to commit to a schedule.
Quote from: TTallan on May 14, 2010, 09:54:21 AM
I can't believe he waits until step 5 to get to the "draw your comic" part. It seems silly to me to go to the trouble of purchasing a domain name and building a website only to discover that you dislike your idea or you don't want to commit to a schedule.
Well he did say:
QuoteYou can do this concurrently or before steps 1 through 4. It is, of course, the whole point and the most important part!
So he implies that it should be done first or along with steps 1-4. But yeah you do have a bit of a point though.
But as I said when I posted it, this is pretty sparse. I don't think anyone could actually start a comic with this advice. Too many holes and oversimplifications in the subject matter.
Most likely Jeph is just trying to make his own life a bit easier by codifying what he gets asked a lot so he can point to it and say "I already answered that here... enjoy."
I dunno, seemed like pretty middling advice. I knew most of this stuff before I posted my first pages, and I can argue with some of it, not least of which being that you don't have to buy a domain name at all. I never did. There's a lot of snobbery in that advice. I've had almost the opposite advice in some parts from Gisele Lagace, and she hasn't done too bad. The only advice he gives that I think isn't really obvious is about learning HTML and CSS, which I've come to think is more important than anyone ever told me when I was starting, and to stick to your update schedule, which almost no one on the amateur level does.
And I agree with TTallan, having the actual creation of the comic so low on the list is bad advice. Even to tell someone they can do it concurrent with the set-up of their website is a tellingly criminal thing to say to someone just starting out. "Oh, by the way, when you get a chance, you might want to make some comics to be in your webcomic." Yes, I know that's not how he means it, but it isn't hard to take it that way and for sure many will. People do so without him telling them. The better advice is not that people can do it concurrently, but they absolutely must be doing it long before step one. It's so important that it shouldn't even be a step in the process, it should be the groundwork on which the process is based.
Jeph isn't known for being an authority on creating webcomics. He'd be the first to say he's just been lucky. As I said I think this post is mostly to have an answer he can point to when the looky-loos come around entertaining fantasies of famous webcomics. I mean, that's just my opinion anyway. I know Jeph well enough to say I don't think he'd intentionally be misleading people but he also probably didn't put tons of thought into this either.
When I said it's hard to argue with the advice I mean that because it is so general and non-specific that there isn't much meat to worry between the teeth.
You can argue with the concurrent story development alongside the first few steps but that's the way I did it and I don't feel like I lost anything in the process.... but then I had other people doing all the web stuff while I basically just advised and I had an artist drawing the comics for me. So I put a lot of his advice out of order.
I think you are right about the computer stuff though Gib. I think many folks underestimate the value of that knowledge. I thank the Lord every time Chadm1n steps in to fix some bug or add a feature for me because I'm lost on that stuff.
Quote from: Jeph JacquesProtip: Seduce a programmer, have them build your site for you. Warning: may have Consequences.
Not many people do a good job of seduction.
Note that I am a programmer looking for a seducer willing to put up with the consequences.
Quote from: Jeph JacquesProtip: Seduce a programmer, have them build your site for you. Warning: may have Consequences.
I'm lucky enough to be my own programmer, designer AND artist.
And I'm full of my own consequences.
When I make the obligatory "But lol, I'm not that good at any of them!" quip I'm not falling back on ye olde "Self-Deprecating Webcomic Artist" schtick. I'm just being practical ;D
* Gingerly goes back to annoying JSP coding...
Quote from: Gibson on May 14, 2010, 11:52:12 AM
I knew most of this stuff before I posted my first pages, and I can argue with some of it, not least of which being that you don't have to buy a domain name at all. I never did. There's a lot of snobbery in that advice. I've had almost the opposite advice in some parts from Gisele Lagace, and she hasn't done too bad.
The sad fact of it is that many people won't take you as seriously if you don't have your own domain or site.
Furthermore, if you want to actually make a business out of it that is of any size, you don't want it to be subject to the whim of a 3rd party comic hosting service (Keenspot has demostrated the hazards of this a few times over the years, it seems).
I see what Jeph is saying. A lot of folks will construct their comic piecemeal, think about branding and "the business" of it later. If you want to get revenue from a comic, much less make a living off it, you need to think of the business parts right from the start, and doing things like: getting a domain, getting hosting, thinking ahead of whether your idea is *marketable*, figuring out where you're going to host it, etc. Until you have a handle on that (which shouldn't take a month), posting a comic is the least of your concern. As he says, you can be working on the comic the whole time, and building a buffer.
If you don't care about any of the commercial stuff, then yes, put it up wherever.
I didn't say put it up wherever, but to suggest that the only way to do it properly is to have your own domain etc is just wrong, especially for people who aren't adept at coding. The problem is much less that people take a comic less seriously on a host than it is that some hosts look like shit. There are good hosts out there and hosts do come with a lot of things independent domains don't, such as in-house advertising and community forums. I've been on Smack Jeeves since my comic began and I do care about the commercial aspects. Not only has being on a host site not hurt me, it's helped me learn how to build my comic into a moderately successful title. I'm not calling Jeph out or anything, I just think he got it wrong. Hosting might not be good for everyone, but it's definitely good for some of us.
If there were one specific formula for creating a winning webcomic there'd be a lot more winning webcomics. Though, most likely, well drawn boobies help accompanying some halfway decent writing probably helps.
What Mr. Jacques wrote represents one way to get it done. Not the only way, to be certain, but a way that either he followed or he wishes he followed. That's all.
time to practise drawing boobies some more...
My page views did spike during a recent nude scene...
I'm actually working on a scifi-based humour titty comic (illustrated by my lovely wife) that should launch sometime this summer. We can observe how long it takes for its popularity to eclipse my other projects to answer this question. We're betting that it won't take long...in fact, that's why we're doing it. It's a huge sellout.
Dude, you're launching a sexy comic drawn by a woman at the same time a site for "filthy comics" drawn by female webcomic artists (http://filthyfigments.com/ (http://filthyfigments.com/)) is launching?
Yeah, that's gold.
Done!
Lets all create dirty movie comics! ;)
How to draw silicon anyone :)
Quote from: Gibson on May 19, 2010, 11:40:04 PM
I didn't say put it up wherever, but to suggest that the only way to do it properly is to have your own domain etc is just wrong, especially for people who aren't adept at coding. The problem is much less that people take a comic less seriously on a host than it is that some hosts look like shit. There are good hosts out there and hosts do come with a lot of things independent domains don't, such as in-house advertising and community forums. I've been on Smack Jeeves since my comic began and I do care about the commercial aspects. Not only has being on a host site not hurt me, it's helped me learn how to build my comic into a moderately successful title. I'm not calling Jeph out or anything, I just think he got it wrong. Hosting might not be good for everyone, but it's definitely good for some of us.
I'm not saying you're wrong, either, but I maintain that in the eyes of many people, not having your own domain name makes them take you less seriously. There's a reason why even Keenspace (of all places) had an option to run your own domain name if you pointed at their DNS servers.
I'm glad you're having good luck with Smack Jeeves. I couldn't stand to have the welfare of my site dependent on the whims of comic hosting anymore, personally.
I think 99% of webcomic readers probably won't even notice one way or the other. A URL is a URL and all that. I think there is something to be said for having a kick ass website which may be harder to do with a host (but as we've seen not impossible) and something else to be said about having a site free of technical issues; which can be alternately harder if you have a crappy host or if you go it alone and are clueless.
But I honestly don't think there are enough people out there who will notice whether you are a domain or a subdomain. They want to read comics and if they click on your ad or a link from another webcomic I can't say I think the first thing any of them will do is say "Jesus this clown doesn't even own his own domain..." and then ragequit the web browser.
And would you want those guys as your fans (assuming your comic isn't about major computer nerdery) anyway?
If you are delivering the goods I don't think it matters all that much. And really who cares if people are going to take you seriously as long as you take yourself seriously that will come across eventually.
dis iz srs bizness. ;D
It matters for two reasons. First, if your URL is your title, it tends to be easier to remember in case someone needs to type it in. Typing in www.comichostingplace.com/mycomic takes longer and is harder to remember than mycomic.com.
Second, it gives a certain air of professionalism. Likely not much, but having your domain suggests you're more serious to me. On the other hand, there are comics that have done well on hosts. Pictures of You is one, to be certain. Simply Sarah is another.
Quote from: JGray on May 20, 2010, 09:31:28 PM
It matters for two reasons. First, if your URL is your title, it tends to be easier to remember in case someone needs to type it in. Typing in www.comichostingplace.com/mycomic takes longer and is harder to remember than mycomic.com.
Second, it gives a certain air of professionalism. Likely not much, but having your domain suggests you're more serious to me. On the other hand, there are comics that have done well on hosts. Pictures of You is one, to be certain. Simply Sarah is another.
Not to mention just about every comic on KeenSpot. Goblins for example has the URL of www.goblinscomic.com which redirects to a much clumsier http://goblins.keenspot.com/
But while I agree a memorable and perhaps shorter URL is a mark of a more professional website and is easier to remember for fans, as I just showed you can be in a hosted situation and still have a slick personal URL that redirects to the clumsier hosted one without much issue. And honestly how many serious comic readers are there nowadays who don't use favorites, RSS, or link in from some site? Well... probably quite a few... but still they are probably somewhat in the minority and probably somewhat less of a loyal fan if they won't bookmark you.
Quote from: NZSteve on May 20, 2010, 07:12:42 PMI couldn't stand to have the welfare of my site dependent on the whims of comic hosting anymore, personally.
I'm not clear on why you think comic hosts are so much more whimsical than having an independent site. The only thing my host has ever asked or expected of me is a warning on my site when I started showing full-frontal stripper nudity, and the only technical trouble I've ever had is a couple hours of down time during the occasional server move. If your host is jerking you around or the people who run it don't bother to fix bugs and such, like Drunk Duck, that's a bad host and you shouldn't have your comics there, but that doesn't mean hosts are all like that. Some of them are incredibly professional and offer loads of technical support. Besides all that, unless you have your own server, you're hosting your comic with
someone and subject to
their whims, whatever that means.
And a lot of the better host sites do offer a unique domain name option now, and the really good ones don't even force a site-banner on you, which makes the legitimacy argument less of an issue. You can have the thin visage of being independent with the community and technical support of a host.
When I first started my webcomic-career (such as it is), my plan was to start off as a sub-domain to a site host. Once I thought that I was ready (presumably, having a large fan base), I was going to move over to my own domain. I've changed my thinking over the years; a domain is a domain regardless if it's hosted by Smackjeeves or by Go Daddy.
The only caveat being that the more words in an URL can make a site forgotten easier if it's not bookmarked or whatever. Having an extra tag like "drunkduck.com" can make your site's name less memorable. Thankfully, some hosts out there have been offering a premium subscription for your own domain name (if it's available, of course). I've been meaning to partake of this subscription, but I've been lazy. Maybe for my birthday...
It should also be noted that there is a distinct difference between sites that have subdomains (comic.comichost.com) and sites that have separate pages (www.comichost.com/comic) for their hosting. The latter tends to be bogged down, laggy and buggy all to hell. DeviantArt functions with subdomains and still manages to be a pretty solid site even with six jillion people all posting their Sailor Moon fan art. If someone is going to use a hosted site, they should be careful to choose one that works. Of course, the same can be said for any kind of domain hosting.
Quote from: Gibson on May 21, 2010, 12:17:00 PM
I'm not clear on why you think comic hosts are so much more whimsical than having an independent site.
Experience, mostly. To be sure, webcomic ASPs have come a long way since Keenspace/Keenspot was the only game in town. I looked around at many of them when figuring out if I wanted to move NZ from its independent shared hosting when I relaunched.
However, when considering independent hosting vs. a webcomic ASP for a comic, I consider things just as you say in your post. i.e. I'll never have to tell about or clear my content with my service provider, for example. Or, say, if I don't like how the merchandise system works, I can swap it out for a new one. I'm not limited by templates for layout if I don't want to be. I know exactly how my site works internally and can tweak it any way I wish.
As for whims: when it comes to hosting here's what a more general purpose host's whims are: pay your bills, don't abuse our network. With webcomic ASPs (especially the very low cost or free ones) they need to make money somehow, and historically they're not that great at doing so on a consistent basis, so they begin to put in little ways to pull away from your revenue, or require ads they run that you (might) get a cut of, etc.
Look, I'm glad your webcomic ASP is working for you. For me they were more problematic than I decided it was worth and so I went it alone. At first it feels like you're out in the wilderness alone without the streamlined internal advertising, ranking and tracking of an ASPs' system bringing in page views and visits, but for me (and for a good number of other creators), the trade-off is worth it in terms of business independence.
I know I had nothing but problems the entire time I mirrored my comics on Drunk Duck, to the point that I couldn't take it anymore. I can imagine it's the same on a lot of sites, but I've never had to deal with any of that on Smack Jeeves. I don't have to clear my content, the only requirement has been that with adult content I was asked to have a warning...and that was only when I started showing graphic nudity. There was no concern at all with pervasive vulgarity, drug and alcohol use and even a bit of light nudity, including full frontal male.
I believe there are hosted ads on the FREE sites, but for $19 a year, I have a membership that ensures, among other things, that there are no host ads on my site. I have a custom-designed template which is even more customizable than I know how to make it, and all the merchandising and ads are my own. The coding is pretty simple too, and the way I know this is that I know nothing about coding and I've still been able to make changes to the site on my own. There's a membership upgrade I can get for $60 that has more features than I can remember, along with a unique domain and a bunch of email addresses and storage and junk.
Maybe Smack Jeeves is the only host that runs quite so open an operation, but I've never had a problem with hosting the comic there. Any limitations I've experienced have been due to my own knowledge. I've been tempted and continue to be tempted to move to an independent site, but I keep finding it difficult to leave everything that I get by being there.
Anyone who enjoys being independent, hey, cool, rock on. The point wasn't that hosting sites are better, but that they aren't worse and the mindset that they're all crap is as foolish as thinking that a comic with an independent site will do better than a hosted one. There are a lot of reasons a webcomic will or won't do well, being quality of the comic, frequency of update and effectiveness of its marketing, along with a certain amount of luck. A .com address might make it a little easier for some people to remember the name, but when you're talking about WEBcomics, most people are coming to your page via links and bookmarks anyway, so how much could it really matter? If your comic is crap, the address won't make a difference, so the concern that some (possibly many) will read that instruction and think that having a domain is more important than having a comic to post there.
I have my own domain, but I don't think it really matters. Most people will come to your site for the first time by clicking on a link (or Stumble. Gods I love Stumble.) and then add it to their bookmarks if they like it. People who actually type in the URL probably aren't that large of an audience subset these days.